[rflight]

Hi Folks i have a 2010 r/t classic automatic, with Mopar CAI, Jet 180 T-Stat, Catch-can, Solo Mach X Catback Exhaust, Diablo InTune CAI 91 octane Canned tune, trying to decide if the Shorty Headers or the 85 MM Throttle-body will be my next mod. Thanks for any help. PS Will i need a custom tune for either of these mods? Thanks again

 

[cdahl383]

I would go with the shorty headers first. I think the stock 80mm TB will support your current setup just fine. The shorty headers have been shown to pick up between 7-10 hp I think based on what I've read on several forums. I would also use the OEM gaskets as they have the heat shields on them and people seem to have better luck avoiding exhaust leaks when using the OEM gaskets.

I would get a custom tune after it's done just to get the most out of everything you've done. You won't need it, but I'm pretty sure it will run better with one. I have a custom email tune for my car and it runs much better/smoother with it than the canned tunes. I went with Johan at Diablosport. Just need a laptop to datalog, send him some datalogs, he sends you a tune, you load it on, do some more datalogging, send it back again, and after a few revisions you should be all set. It's kind of a fun process.

 

[70barcuda]

Neither will provide a big gain in HP, the shorties will probably get you 6-8 HP (from tests I've seen) and the TB will get you 0-8 HP depending on who you want to believe. Also many believe the TB works better if you get a custom tune in conjunction with it.

I ran an 85mm BBK TB on my old R/T and while I never dyno tested it I thought it worked well. Never got around to putting any shorties on so no personal experience there. Here's a link to an old thread I did back when I did the TB there might be some useful information in it for you http://www.challengerforumz.com/showthread.php?t=71162 I would probably lower the estimated HP gain numbers now though, the one's I put in the thread were what I found in several articles in various Mopar magazines at the time and were most likely overly optimistic based on what I've seen written since.

In addition to commercial shorty headers you might want to consider adding a set of used SRT exhaust manifolds as they can be had relatively cheaply and add basically the same gain.

The final factor to consider is ease of installation. The TB can be easily installed and the shorties can be a bear or if hired out certainly more costly while the TB can be done by you fairly quickly. So if you aren't doing the job yourself the cost of the header install may need to be factored into your decision.

Personally I'd do both (using a set of SRT exhaust manifolds) and grab a custom tune if possible. Good luck with your decision. :smileup:

 

[GreenGoblin]

I would go with the headers first. I had some on my ram with a 5.7 and it really woke it up on the bottom end, the acceleration and throttle response was much better an seemed to pull harder. I also put a porter tb on an it seemed to mess up the air/fuel ratio until I got a email tune to fix it. I think it confused my computer an it over corrected because it killed my gas mileage an power and the tune fixed it.

 

[rflight]

Next Mod Shortys or 85 mm Throttlebody

Thanks guys for the replys, I found some srt shortys but the guy wants $ 450 and $ 500 for the mids, that's crazy, looking at BBK ceramic coated or JBA shortys for now. If I get a custom tune after the header install , will I need one again if I install a 85 mm throttle-body later down the road?? or if I install Hi-Flo Cats at a later time?? I `am going to try the header install myself, I`ve read its lots of fun, lol. Thanks again

 

[climberccm]

You wont need a custom tune with just adding shorty headers and or 85mm TB. However before you go plucking down money for this mod and that mod think about where you want to go with the car. If ultimatley you want more power, you'd be better served with a head/cam combo or simply supercharging your car.

If you do go with the shorty headers and TB I would recommend a custom tune via email or at a dyno. If you go the email route be sure the package you buy includes updates based on data logs that you provide tuner.

I'd also contact a vendor on the forum and talk about where you want to take the car. They can help you make clearer choices about which mods will really help you achieve your goals.

Good luck with your modding.:smileup:

 

[williams rt]

You wont need a custom tune with just adding shorty headers and or 85mm TB. However before you go plucking down money for this mod and that mod think about where you want to go with the car. If ultimatley you want more power, you'd be better served with a head/cam combo or simply supercharging your car.

If you do go with the shorty headers and TB I would recommend a custom tune via email or at a dyno. If you go the email route be sure the package you buy includes updates based on data logs that you provide tuner.

I'd also contact a vendor on the forum and talk about where you want to take the car. They can help you make clearer choices about which mods will really help you achieve your goals.

Good luck with your modding.:smileup:

Good advice here, decide what you want to do with the car performance wise in the long run.
If anyone wants to know if a mod is worth doing? It's easy to answer, if it does not require a tune change then the mod adds little to no HP.

 

[dodge boy]

All good advise above, it's so easy to waste money when your overall goals change, think this one out very carefully.

 

[RacinDemon]

I have shorties done and I if I had to do it again I would go with long tubes. Installation is the same, it suxs equally to get the shorty and long tubes on. If your set on the shorties I would skip that and get catless mids. A little louder sounding and about the same as shorties power wise. Also cost less and you can install yourself. I would not get a throttle body unless its the last thing on your list. A lot of money some go tfor about 430 dollars for about 5 hp if your lucky. My car dynoed pretty good with custom tune, shorty, mufflers, catch can.

 

[RacinDemon]

By the way noticed you said you wanted to try the header install urself. If you have not done it before I wouldn't try it. Its a real pita. I believe its easier to pull the entire motor out.

 

[dodge boy]

By the way noticed you said you wanted to try the header install urself. If you have not done it before I wouldn't try it. Its a real pita. I believe its easier to pull the entire motor out.

You are correct, it is a royal PITA, a lot of members here swear it's well spent money to have it done. Friendoffur, who is a regular poster here did it and will atest to that.

 

[friendoffur]

You are correct, it is a royal PITA, a lot of members here swear it's well spent money to have it done. Friendoffur, who is a regular poster here did it and will atest to that.

Every post I've ever read by someone who had them installed by a shop paid at least 500 bucks and often a good bit more. I did mine in my driveway on jack stands and I can say that is CHEEP!!!!!...LOL
http://www.challengerforumz.com/showthread.php?t=66982

 

[rflight]

Next Mod Shortys or 85 mm Throttle-body

Thanks for the warning guys on the header install, i was looking at it a while back and hats off to the guys who did this in their driveways without a lift. I to will tackle it with out a lift, theres not much room at all but maybe if i remove the mounts ( one out of time ) and lift the engine some it may help a little, worked on a few older cars before but these newer cars seem to be very limited for space. Thanks for helping me with my next mod. Shortys coming up. PS i had two quotes of $ 1000 and $ 1200 for the headers install. ooch :smileup:

 

[cdahl383]

Wow $1,000 to install shorty headers! That sort of negates even doing it. If you can do it yourself that'd be the way to go. Or maybe get some more quotes. I could see $300-500 but $1,000 or more is insane. Good luck and let us know how it goes!

 

[70barcuda]

Take some pictures during the install, if you figure out any ways to make things a bit easier be sure to post them up. :smileup:

 

[jkelly16]

You should be paying around 5 hours of labor to install the shorties.

 

[friendoffur]

With the first hand knowledge of having done this job....if I was in business with a shop and a lift....all the right tools...and the overhead to have all those things...there is NO WAY I would do this for less than 500 bucks....and only then if it was the aftermarket shortys that connect right up to the 5.7 mids. To do the SRT shortys AND necessary mids...with the adaptations necessary to connect up to the rest of the 5.7 pipes...no less than 600....but thats just my opinion of what I would need to stay in business.

 

[cdahl383]

Too bad it's not like putting headers on an old car. That only takes about an hour and you can reach everything with ease. Not much room in our engine bays on these cars.

 

[rflight]

Next Mod shortys or 85 mm Throttle-body

Yea Carl I`m after swapping a cam , carb, intake, and installing headers on my old Chrysler and this 5.7 looks scary compared to the old small blocks. Going to order the coated shortys today and do the install later in the spring when the car comes out of storage, I may try my hand at data logging then and go for a custom tune. I don't race the car but I would like a little more bottom end power, the biggest thing I would like to figure out and maybe a custom tune would help is that the car is not consistent. With the same conditions / car temps / outside temps /etc.. it seems first when I download a tune the car is stronger, does a 8-10 car length burnout but after a very short while it fades off some and only does a 2-3 car length burnout. Maybe its because I put new tires on also and now have better grip lol. Oh well thanks guys for all the help, this fourm rocks

 

[cdahl383]

Yeah working on older cars is much easier. Pulling the engine or swapping in a cam/intake/carb/distributor is all easy to do since you can get to everything easily. No computer or wires or sensors to deal with either.

Interested to see how the shorty headers turn out for you. What kind did you order? JBA or BBK?

I think a custom tune is a good way to go. You can get an email tune from a guy like Johan at Diablosport and it will be noticeably better than the canned tunes. I noticed more bottom end grunt with the custom tune over the canned tunes. The car also seemed to make power more smoothly over the RPM band. If you can datalog, then doing an email tune is the way to go, much cheaper than a dyno tune and with the basic mods you have it should be just fine.

Could just be the tires are cold for your first burnout and once they heat up they grip a little better? Could also be heatsoak killing some power after driving it around some if it's in hot weather?

Sometimes you just need to pull the #2 fuse to reset the adaptives back to stock. If you drive like a granny for a little while, or you're forced to due to traffic, weather, etc. The car can get a little sluggish. I usually pull mine every oil change or every other oil change. It makes a noticeable difference in the winter after driving slowly in bad weather for a long time. In the summer not as much since I can get on it more often haha!

I agree, this forum is definitely cool!