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Discussion Starter #1
I am brand new to this or any forums and 1 week new to owning a low mile, stock 6.1 m6. I love this thing! However, like most srt8 owners i'm sure, not enough power. I know the predator is no longer and replaced with trinity and intune. How are these different? Which one should I go with and are they pretty easy to operate? Which cai is going to help the most? I do plan on installing the 180 thermostat and changing the fans accordingly. Finally, if I decide to, what cam/heads combo will give me enough muscle to spank the camaros and stock" everyone in the world has one" mustangs? I may have a person who will install the cam/head package, however, do i need my own programmer? He is known for tuning the camaros/fords and an occasional mopar. I havn't met this guy yet but he was seen in his shop with a challenger on his dyno and a laptop hooked up to it. Any realistic suggestions would be appreciated. I'm not interested in forced induction at this time. Just bolt ons/possibly head/cam swap etc and what I can expect as far as performance. Thanks in advance!
 

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The Intune is the basic tuner that replaced the Predator - the Trinity has all the bells & whistles. They're not difficult to operate, just be sure you know what you're doing if you start messing with timing and air / fuel settings. You can discuss in detail with the vendors to make your choice.
CAI's are for the most part good for some underhood bling. The air intake on these cars is pretty good to start with - don't expect much of a HP gain from a CAI.
You will need a tuner if you do cam & heads. Be sure your tuner guy is well versed with this HEMI engine if you have him mess with your tune. You can cause more harm than good if you don't know what your doing.
 

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I would start by saying that you will definitely find that there are probably ten different answers from ten different people about the direction you should take given your situation. So, I will throw in my two cents (this comes with months of research on forums about this very topic).

First, CAI...there is proof that you don't need to change your CAI as the one in the car is already VERY good. Many aftermarket ones aren't even true CAI's anyway. However, if you MUST install one, as I did, then I guess there are some things to consider.

functionality- made of a material that doesn't conduct heat (carbon fiber, plastic)
looks- made to look "factory" or "blingy" or not "plastic" like the stock one

Again, it will all come down to personal taste, but I'm sure you will have several opinions on CAI. They do provide a cool noise over stock though, even if, they don't technically make any performance difference over stock. Given the opportunity to do it over again I would probably go with the arrington CAI over the MOPAR. The metal on the MOPAR conducts alot of heat, but at the same time I love it being "Mopar." So...form over function for me in that case.


Second, It seems that many people on here "the Z" either go with HHP or PWR heads. I would stay away from some other internet companies like I__rtia Motorsports (fill in the blank) because after MUCH research on here and other forums, there are some unhappy customers, though I'm sure there are some happy ones as well, and the later is not a supporting vendor on the "Z."

I chose HHP because of Josh's (owner of HHP) reputation when it came time for tuning. They offer a really nice head and cam combination (I chose the stage2r cam with stage 2 heads) that doesn't decrease driveability in the least. In my car I notice a considerable "butt dyno" difference, as I only have it email tuned at this stage, but it idles smoothly with a nice "lope" if those aren't actually contradictory statements. Point is, there is no "surging" with the cam and there's noticeable power increase over "stock."

Lastly, the tuning is a big deal as well (maybe even bigger than the heads and cam) because without good tuning your car still will run like garbage even with a "decent" tune and new heads and cam. It is my opinion that you'd almost be better served with email tuning from someone experienced with the hemi setup, like Josh or Johan, than with a dyno tune from someone who does them once in a while. I was in the same situation you are in as there wasn't really a good choice for "hemi" tuners around my area. I found one that would do it, but he said that I would have to drop the car off for two week and it would cost me a minimum of $750 because they were "difficult" to tune and he doesn't do the work "fulltime." So, I opted for the email tuning from HHP (still not done), but I'm happy with my choice and here's why...I was having idling problems with the car and it turned out that the throttle body (BBK 85mm) can cause tuning problems. After some trial and error Josh had figured that to be the problem and knew it was a common problem. Then, I was running rich at WOT (around 10.8) and Josh knew there was a computer code or something to protect the temperature of the catalytic converters and had to turn it "off" so I installed the tune and am running 12.2 WOT. Also, he or another tuner familiar with these cars can turn off the computer response to certain "codes" that trip CEL's. If I had taken my car to someone who didn't know about these specific problems, who knows if I would have CEL's all the time or even a running car. These guys will even adjust the fans for your 180 thermostat.

I will say one thing about the dyno tuner though... If you go that route you will be done in one shot for tuning...hopefully. If you plan on email tuning, plan on datalogging several times. Oh, and that will definitely require a trinity (preferred) or an intune as you stated.

Hope this helps.
 

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^X2 on all that. Went with HHP for my Supercharger. I originally had my car tuned elsewhere. It was where I had my exhaust done. But, I knew after being on here and reading enough that HHP would be doing any more major mods I wanted in the future. So, the car is running like a top right now. Supercharger kicks in and throws your head back and makes you feel like a kid again. Cant even imagine how the Hellcat feels. But the car is running great. Incredibly streetable, which was most important to me. Matter of fact im driving it for vacation down to Hilton Head Island, South Carolina tomorrow. I also had a post tune issue that would have boggled someone less knowledgable with our cars. Josh is great and wont leave you stranded if there is an issue.
 

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For the tuner, the Intune is sufficient for loading pre-made tunes or doing simple things like fan settings and tire size changes. I don't think the Intune is capable of full custom tuning. You need someone with the CMR software. You would then use your Intune to load the CMR tune. I met Josh from HHP at Moparpalooza this this past May. Only talked to him briefly and overheard another convo and he seemed to know his stuff. Some guys are making good power with After Hours Mopar Performance (AMP) parts as well. All depends on your location or how far you will travel I guess.
 

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All good advice above, a custom tune is a must if you go with a head and cam package. If you are into 1/4 mile racing you might want to look at a few other Bolton's.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Thanks for all your help thus far. So if a cai isn't really needed for performance, would a drop in k & n be sufficient? From what I think I'm hearing from you guys, go with the trinity right? I'm just going basic for now since I need the financial bleeding to stop with just getting the car, ins plus tag etc. I'm thinking of a basic tune to free up a couple horses, 180 Tstat and I guess a drop in filter. Would the trinity be of any help when doing the heads/cam swap or should that be left for a custom tune? If I do the basic tune, would I still be doing a 91 octane cai tune? I'm not trying to be remedial but I don't want to do anything that will mess this car up. I just want to make it a lil more responsive till I can save some coin for cam/heads etc. thanks in advance for any future help! I just don't want to buy something that won't help much or won't be advantageous with more mods down the road. I live in Oklahoma City and have yet found any mopar specialists
 

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The Trinity tuner is perfect for a Custom tune. When going with a canned tune the gas that your using comes into play, the 91 tune will be good if you can't get Quality 93 octane. Keep in mind that you won't feel the power increase on the seat of your pants, actually you will probably pick up a few tenths in the 1/4 mile.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Thanks again guys. Let me pick your brains a bit further. Say I wait a while for the cam/heads route and go with just bolt ons for now. What are the recommendations that would actually give me performance gains I could feel. I'm guessing just a canned 91 tune, drop in air filter, 180 Tstat. What else that may help me out without breaking the bank. Again, I don't want to buy anything now that won't b helpful with more aggressive mods down the road. I won't be doing any custom tunes on my own. What rwhp can I expect with what I have planned and with the recommendations that you guys provide? The best fuel I can get here is 91.
 

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The next bolt on I am considering is a throttle body and email tune package from Hemifever. A larger throttle body will definitely support your future mods and the email tune is far superior to any canned tune from what I have read. RWHP is anyone's guess and the tune has a lot to do with it. I do recommend getting a baseline done before any mods so you know what you started with and what the mods did.
 

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Thanks again guys. Let me pick your brains a bit further. Say I wait a while for the cam/heads route and go with just bolt ons for now. What are the recommendations that would actually give me performance gains I could feel. I'm guessing just a canned 91 tune, drop in air filter, 180 Tstat. What else that may help me out without breaking the bank. Again, I don't want to buy anything now that won't b helpful with more aggressive mods down the road. I won't be doing any custom tunes on my own. What rwhp can I expect with what I have planned and with the recommendations that you guys provide? The best fuel I can get here is 91.

You should fill out the info on your car so that others can help you here.
But It sounds like you have just about all the bases covered being that you have ruled out Supercharging and probably a Nitrous set up. If you have an auto you could possibly go with a taller gear which would help you with lower end performance but it wont give you any additional H.P.
 
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Not to contradict anyone on the "Z" here, but for the sake of discussion. I would suggest a catch can. It doesn't supply any performance upgrade, though it could help with detonation, and hypothetically provide a cleaner burning fuel mixture. Nearly everyone has them listed in their mods list,and for the money it also provides a nice sense of modding without "breaking the bank." Besides, after driving for a little while you will see how much oil really gets recirculating though your intake and be glad you have one.

As mentioned before, a throttle body is a nice addition. However, do some research about the size you want, as there are many options. Then think about that in the long run of what you want to accomplish in your build long term. I installed a bbk 85mm power plus just to have to go with a MM ported 85mm for tuning purposes as it is a factory throttle body ported (all ACTUAL factory wiring as well). You may also want to look at arrington or MM for an 85 or 90mm, but in my opinion it would only make more sense to go with the 90 if you planned on porting your intake manifold. Many will probably disagree, but bigger isn't necessarily better all the time. Again the best thing would be to ask someone with extensive knowledge for an opinion, HHP, Arrington, etc and decide for yourself. I will say that a new throttle body may increase throttle response, but the gains of 15 hp or something like that are probably not realistic.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Any special brand of catch can? Best place to order one? Is this unique to the 6.1 or all hemis? Sorry for all the questions but knowledge is power right? Haha. Finally, are they hard to install?
 

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A catch can is a very easy install, I bought mine from Speedlogix who is a vender here.
 

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Probably the most cost-effective HP gain is going to be Nitrous.
The best looking / sounding gains are minimal (CAI, 180* t-stat, Cat-back exhaust).
The catch-can is a great idea. It keeps oil vapors from returning back to your intake.

HP & Torque cost money. How fast ya wanna go? :D
 

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Discussion Starter #17
You all are awesome help! I really don't want to go the spray rout. If I go the heads/cam direction, is it cheaper/better to have my heads ported n worked over or buy new performance heads. Just wondering
 

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I would say as far as the heads are concerned..that is a tough call. I went with the core exchange and just got the heads from HHP. That way my car wasn't just sitting there for the work to get finished, however, it does cost a little more as the cores have to be insured and sent back. The advantage to having YOUR heads done is the obvious knowledge of the amount of mileage on your heads compared to a core exchange and that they are original to your car. It really is going to depend on how much down time you can tolerate with the car sitting there waiting for porting work, or maybe you could find someone who can do the teardown, porting, valve and spring work, cam install and reinstall all in one place. That would be ideal, but for those of us living far distances from an installer familiar with hemis, I would say exchanging heads and finding a good install shop with email tuning will be the best bet. Obviously, not ideal, but probably the most reasonable.
 
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