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Question on new upgrades

19K views 173 replies 12 participants last post by  glawrung56 
#1 · (Edited)
I got a Scat Pack Stage 1 tuner, Magnaflow competition 3" cat back exhaust, It is a shaker so it has a CAI and I have a Hellcat air tube to add to it. I have JBA longtubes and Hi flow cat mid pipes coming. I talked to Mopar and they said as long as the headers aren't directly responsible for the Failure they won't effect my warranty and my extended at national said they are cool with headers. The Question; Does the stage 1 tuner have enough learning capability to adjust to the headers? Also, I am thinking about getting rid of the resonator on the air tube, I have two options, the Mopar aluminum tube or the plastic charger. I have read about aluminum holding heat so maybe the plastic Charger. I'd appreciate your thoughts. I have an oil can on it, I used a heat gun to melt the big hump underneath the resonator flat so it fits pretty well. Just don't care for the way it looks.
 
#3 ·
So if I returned them for short tube would it be the same?
 
#4 ·
Thank you Jazz blue for your response. Also I had sent an email with the same question to one of the big performance racing web sights and they tell me that I would not need a retune for either long or short tube headers but that I could get more power if I did but it wouldn't be necessary. So I am more confused then ever. I don't discount any info I get from the members on this sight as a lot of what I have done already comes from posts on here anyone else have any experience on this subject? I would appreciate your input.
 
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#6 ·
Just got off the phone with prefix, the company that arrow racing merged with, and talked to Dale. He said the Stage 1 has a 30% fuel ratio learning capability and that headers are about 15% with high flow cats. So there would be no problem with adding headers as it would learn to work with the extra air. Thanks again Jazz blue. I want the headers bad enough that I think I am going to do it. I'll let you know how it works out. Also Dale said that it is an open tuner for those who want to know.
 
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#8 · (Edited)
Sometimes the issue comes up, but can be dealt with by using 02 restrictor extensions as I was told, and I believe I saw it on here in some posts as well. Oregon has no emissions testing so not a problem there is it? I don't doubt what your saying Jazz, but Dale writes the programs for this tuner, so I hope he knows what he's doing, and the problems that will come up are easily fixed I think. The extensions would be a problem if we had emissions testing but I don't think there's a tech even in Idaho, which is the closest place, that would know what he was looking at if he saw them. I think it's worth a try, if you turn out to be right I'll buy you a double shot and admit I should have listened. Thanks for your help but I hope your wrong.:D
 
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#9 ·
Hey I got the headlight air tube installed. Remembered to take the filter out, thanks for the heads up frommmmm, hell I forgot who put that on here, but thanks. Easy install.
 
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#10 · (Edited)
When you said you got a Scat Pack Stage 1 tuner, what exactly did you mean?

#1 A MOPAR pre-programmed Scat Pack Stage 1 ECM?

#2 An unlocked ECM, with a tuner like the Diablo, and written tunes like Hemifever does?

What Jazz Blue SP 392 regarding the long tube headers and high flow cats told you is correct, I have heard though, that the O2 extender will work, but I don't know that for sure?

Sean at Hemifever tuning wrote a tune for me for the Magnaflow High Flow Cats throwing a CEL, but I used the lower hole, not the upper hole, on the high flow cats and so far it has not thrown a CEL.

But I am running shorty headers not long tube.
 
#11 · (Edited)
The tuner is a Mopar stage1, As I told jazz blue in a previous thread, I called prefix, who bought out or took over arrow racing and talked to Dale I believe is his name.
He is the one that writes the tunes for the scat pack tuners for Mopar, He said that the stage 1 mopar tuner has a 30% learning capability on the air fuel mix, his take was that long tubes with high flow cats is about 15% variance so the tuner should adjust to the air flow I get from the headers and mid pipe cats which only have One 02 hole below the cats.
I believe Jazz knows what he is talking about, but Dale is the one responsible for the Mopar scat pack ECM's tuning and he also told me that the tune is an actual tune not as radical as a say Diablo but a high performance tune non the less. He also told me that the ECM is unlocked so it is tunable by an outside tuner, I believe that SCT X4 has the codes for it, for one, although that would void my warranty.
So I thought I would take the chance and try it. There is always the mini cat extenders for a back up, but Dale and my Mopar Shop thinks it will learn and they can remove the CEL after it adapts.
While I'm at it I would also say as an update after a lot of research I went with a stock Charger air tube as it looks like it will more efficiently force the air into the throttle body with its funnel shape and transfer less heat to the air The aluminum looks a lot cooler, But I am more about what works then whats cool most of the time. Whats your take on all of this? I have an appointment to have everything mounted Sept.1.
 
#12 ·
Sounds legitimate to me, post what happens so anyone else viewing this thread will get the information that could help them. With my setup the shorty headers and high flow cats have really made a serious difference in performance, you'll be well pleased with yours.
 
#13 ·
Thanks, I have my fingers crossed and I am getting a bit impatient. I used to do this stuff myself but its getting harder to get off the floor at 67. I have a lift for my harley's. Maybe it's time for a car lift. I'll post the results.
 
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#17 ·
I feel you man, I'm 66, be 67 as well in a few months, we just can't do things like we used to, I just completed my shorty headers and high flow cats, but I could only work about 3 ~ 4 hours a day because of the heat.

Built a drive on ramp system in the back yard because jacking the car and using jack stands was getting to dangerous, the jack slipped once back when I swapped out the differential, and that prompted me to build the ramp system.

Land vehicle Vehicle Car Rim Performance car

Pasture Grass Grassland Natural landscape Meadow


Works pretty good actually and a lot safer.
 
#14 ·
I say good for you for calling dale at prefix he is a great person to talk to if you have questions on the scatpack stages pcms for the 5.7 engine. he also told me if my pcm was throwing codes for my header / high flow cat install he would adjust or tweek it but didn't think it would be necessary
 
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#15 ·
How has it worked for you so far? Yea it's great he takes the time to help us out.
 
#16 ·
I'm not done with my install yet ,got delayed my daughter came for up from nc for her birthday and it's been a 3 day party .glad to go to work today :confused:(did I just type that )just to sober up. should be done by Wednesday eve. i'll let you know. anyway dale is so cool and the fact he takes time for questions and replies with great detail is amazing. good luck with your install on the headers, and there is always 02 spacers if needed
 
#19 ·
My car is in the shop getting the exhaust put on now and tomorrow if they can or after the weekend if not the scat pack tuner will be put on. I feel like a kid at christmas. Some of us just never grow up I guess. Then I can start saving for the scat pack 2.:D
 
#22 ·
You might want to recheck I think they were out for a while when arrow and Prefix got together.
The service dept. down here said they couldn't get them and so I put on after mrkt exhaust and found the tuner. Now I see they are offering the kit again.
 
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#21 ·
I feel you man, I'm 66, be 67 as well in a few months, we just can't do things like we used to, I just completed my shorty headers and high flow cats, but I could only work about 3 ~ 4 hours a day because of the heat.

Built a drive on ramp system in the back yard because jacking the car and using jack stands was getting to dangerous, the jack slipped once back when I swapped out the differential, and that prompted me to build the ramp system.

View attachment 198926
View attachment 198928

Works pretty good actually and a lot safer.
That is a nice ramp system!
 
#23 ·
Ok, the headers, high flow cats and the 3" magnaflow are all installed. It sounds awesome but not much of a power boost, in fact I might have lost a little on the low end. I'm not sure.
I am still running the stock tuner and it hasn't thrown a CEL yet but I just took a little test cruise, as I am afraid to drive it too much until I get the scat pack tuner on Tuesday.
I think the tune is going to make a big difference in it, but it sounds like a hemi now! Not a lot of drone when your cruising but you can tell when you give it gas now. And so can the neighbors.;)
 
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#24 ·
I think I heard it from here:D nice .as far as losing a Little on the bottem end your probably right longtubes are more for mid to higher rpm range, shorties are low end and up.but don't sound as good
 
#25 ·
Ok, Stage 1 is complete, JBA LT headers,JBA highflow cats, 3" Magnaflow competition cat back exhaust,Hellcat cold air headlight tube w/shaker CAI, sounds awesome, no drone at cruise speeds, no CEL'S yet, but I lost time on my 0-60 it spins the tires to much and I have not figured out how to get a clean launch yet. Butt Dyno says we got a nice performance boost. I am happy with my choices so far. I'll figure out the launch.
 
#26 ·
Update on my stage one. threw a CEL after about 50 miles. That was the first time I really got on it at high speed after the mods.
I went to the dealer and they checked it, all four 02's fired at once two said too rich two said too lean, they reset the CEL for me and said if it happened again too come in and make sure it's omissions and then drive it for a while to see if it goes out.
That was 300 miles and several 0-60 tries ago so far so good.
But I do owe Jazz Blue a double:(
 
#29 ·
I lost time on my 0-60 it spins the tires to much and I have not figured out how to get a clean launch yet. Butt Dyno says we got a nice performance boost. I am happy with my choices so far. I'll figure out the launch.
I'm in the same boat I'm looking into sticker tires, but, that I can still use on the street leaning towards the Nitto NT05s. Hajo says they stick pretty good on his Hellcat.
 
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#30 ·
I'm extremely curious on how your challenger is doing, performance wise, with the 3" exhaust.

@RyzRT and I have been talking somewhat extensively on this subject through direct messaging in the ForumZ and he's given me sound advice on sticking with the 2.5" exhaust with my 5.7.

What are your thoughts on it so far? Do you think your lack of performance issues might have something to do with not getting enough back pressure due to the 3" exhaust from engine to the tailpipe?

I've been actively searching for a thread like this and yours has been exactly what I've been looking for.

Something else that I'm curious about...I have my heart set on long-tube headers but that doesn't mean I can't change my mind. All of that being said, what are everyone's thoughts on long-tube headers that have a 3" outlet connected to 3" hi-flow catalytic converters reducing down...to say...2.5" exhaust systems? Could this possibly work or would it be disastrous?
 
#39 · (Edited)
I'm extremely curious on how your challenger is doing, performance wise, with the 3" exhaust.

@RyzRT and I have been talking somewhat extensively on this subject through direct messaging in the ForumZ and he's given me sound advice on sticking with the 2.5" exhaust with my 5.7.

What are your thoughts on it so far? Do you think your lack of performance issues might have something to do with not getting enough back pressure due to the 3" exhaust from engine to the tailpipe?

I've been actively searching for a thread like this and yours has been exactly what I've been looking for.

Something else that I'm curious about...I have my heart set on long-tube headers but that doesn't mean I can't change my mind. All of that being said, what are everyone's thoughts on long-tube headers that have a 3" outlet connected to 3" hi-flow catalytic converters reducing down...to say...2.5" exhaust systems? Could this possibly work or would it be disastrous?
I listened to the Borla 2.75 and the Corsa 2.75 exhaust, which is what I was told the Mopar Scat Pack 1 kit came with. I did not like the sound of either one of them but loved the deep throaty sound of the Magnaflow Competition.
Everything I read on here said to listen to all of the exhaust you could find and get the one you like and as I was trying to get a Scat Pack stage 1 to save my warranty I figured .25" would not make much difference in the exhaust from the Mopar kit.
I studied all the Scat pack Kits 1,2&3 and what each one changed and decided that since I was doing the Exhaust I would save time and money by doing the whole thing at once. Stage 3 changes the exhaust manifold to headers.
The high flow cats were a gamble so I called Dale at prefix racing to find out how much adaptability the stage 1 tuner had for the air flow changes and was told that it should adapt ok. At this point it seems to have done so.
The JBA headers and mid pipes with high flow cats are both 3" but the outlet on the mids was for stock exhaust which was 2.125 on the auto I believe, so I had the reduction cut off and added 3" extensions, so I am 3" from the collectors back.
It is a little loud inside the car, so I am wrapping the trunk in dynamat, but there is no drone issue when cruising down the freeway. It just gets loud when you get on it. I love the sound of the Magnaflows.
As far as the performance goes, I have not dyno'd the car but my BUTT DYNO says we picked up significant HP and Torque. My only problem is that I spin the tires when I launch enough that I have lost time on the 0-60 times. So I need to get stickier tires to get better traction. Spinnin ain't winnin!
The thing you need to remember is I put a stage 1 mopar ecm on with the exhaust upgrade which really woke up the other mods. So you will need a tuner to use the headers and exhaust upgrades.
Just for the record I was told that I would get a constant CEL with the high flow cats.
Without the tuner The other mods didn't do much and I did throw a CEL shortly after I put on the Stage 1 tuner but I believe that it has or will adapt as it hasn't thrown one now for quit a while. We'll see.
I hope that helps The car runs like a raped ape and I plan on Cams, Titanium valve springs and 5/16 push rods next but I don't think I will change the heads as the stock heads flow really nice. I might change my mind. but either way when I do I'll have to go to a stage 3 Mopar tuner.
As for the 3" exhaust being too big, maybe, But .25" isn't a big leap and I got a lot of why nots to go with the too bigs from people who do this for a living. So like everything, It comes down to opinion and as I was going to get the cams I thought why not.
Ryzrt is probably right I should have gone with a 392 to begin with but I loved this RT plus, color and interior and Shaker and all the things about it and with the added money for the bigger engine with the other upgrades it was easier to come up with the occasional few thou in cash then to make bigger payments every month on the car and the increase in insurance ect. So once again it depends on your finances. I am retired (fixed income) but I have a small business on the side that nets me a few thousand every so often, but is not constant and I like tinkering with engines and stuff.. So this is what works for me. Once again it is about Opinion.
 
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