Well thank you all for your advice in my other thread. I took it to heart, and am back to looking at an R/T. Pretty sure I am heading out tomorrow to do some shopping. They have a torred RT with the track pack, 6 speed, 20" rims and the 430 u connect. I really dont care about the rims because they will be replaced anyway, and at $1300 I guess I am stuck with them, as their is a limited supply of rts around here in a color I want. (NO more Black cars!!!) last three cars were black lol I am done with the second job. Sticker is $34,075 with the $4000 off that takes it to $30,000. On the R/T where should I start the negotiations? I am thinking 25k and bringing up the rims as one of the reasons. and hopefully walking out at 27.5k including the rebates. Should I start lower? Higher?